AO jaan, intolernece is a national past time for Iranians. Most of us are guilty of it although some are far worse than others. The ability to block people was the brainchild of "esfand aashena" who no longer posts stuff here (thankfully). He blocked me alonmg with several others.

I find it fascinating that some seemingly secular people buldge up in the neck when they hear the word Israel. I have seen it time and again. I guess you can chalk that up to intolerence as well.   

I have always said that people rise to their potential; Esslamist regime in Iran appears to be the limit of our potential, so congrats to all.

"Esslamist regime in Iran appears to be the limit of our potential," sadly its true and it does not have to do anything with this blog. 

Esactly! A government is a reflection of its culture and its people. That's why we have the IR. Seriously, how many of these guys have "ghahr'ed" and left the site because Fred posts blogs? How many of them have declared "ya man ya Fred" ultimatums to JJ? Why can't these people stand a f**king BLOG? What is wrong with them?

Good thing they can't get a hold of Fred inside Iran. The poor guy will be lynched in Azadi Sqaure for posting blogs that they don't like.

And I think that JJ put together this whole "comment control" thing (which Goosfand Ashena was a big advocate of) so that he can have the site on auto-pilot while he traveled the world. He just doesn't have the time to deal with it. 

AO,

Since you mentioned my name and used phrases like “intolerance”, I will try to simplify my views even more.

I do not read blogs, links or comments by the folks that I do not like. I have enough self-discipline and self-respect that I am not even tempted to read such material even if I see my name in the first line of a comment or a blog. So rest assured that folks can post their material without any reaction from me.

Now, here is the problem that I was trying to express. The site has a fairly limited space for featured links (5 per language), blogs (10), cartoons (1). When people come in and post a lot of material, they push out the other people’s material from the 1^st page. Now considering that the overwhelming number of their material is not original and comes either from MardomReport.net (which is a great site, thanks to Kaveh) or cartoons from Nikahang’s site, or blogs that are basically a repeat of the links with a couple of slogans, then the more aggressive users tend to flood the site with the material that is not even theirs or original. They take away the real estate from others.

And that’s my problem with this chaotic, free for all occupied territory. It is like going to an Iranian dinner party and seeing the guy who ate all the Tahdig is now exercising his freedom and is smoking and farting in the middle of the living room.

Democracy and freedom of speech also requires people who respect everybody’s rights and put a limit on their own.

Dear Faramarz - I don't see it that way. Fred's blogs take up most of the front page because there are no other blogs. It's not his fault. If you or others on the site (including me) post blogs with the same regularity as Fred, then his posts will be pushed out. But we don't. So, we can't assign him the fault. And he shouldn't stop writing just becasue the format of the site pushes other blogs out when others don't blog and he does. That's something that the Admin should address. Fred shouldn't be blamed for it.

But look, this is not the first time people have attacked Fred for various reasons. First it was the whole concoction that "Fred" is an account by a group of Mossad agents. Then it was that he's Jewish. Then it was that he's an Israeli. Then it was that he's a part of a Baha'i cabal. Then SAM wrote a blog that Fred is bringing the site down and he "ghahred" and left for iranian.com. Souri (among many others) also issued the same threat--followed by a blog in Persian that said "goor-e pedar-e har chi yahoodiyeh." Now, the excuse is that he's taking up too much space on the site. I don't know what the next excuse will be... 

So your “solution” is that we all do the same thing; climbing all over each other, grabbing material from here and there and stick it on the site, pushing and shoving each other’s posts. That looks more like the bread lines in the impoverished countries than democracy! We experienced that in the comment section of IC; comments over comments by Mash Ghasem and Amirparvizformonarchy.

I still believe in quality, originality and humor and I’ll make sure that my material always contains that.

How about Majid Naficy? He posts as much as Fred does, and in fact right now he has two featured blogs on the front page. Fred has three. Why isn't there any fuss about Majid Naficy? Should he be controlled too? 

AO.

Welcome to the club my friend! This bache akhoond soosool  has also blocked me from ALL his accounts!

This bache akhoond NIACi, has created tens of accounts on internet; "SAM", " niloofar parsi", "minimalist", (and I stop here for now!) . No matter under which account or disguise the bache akhoond logs in to spread his poison, he has one simple aim;   to harass and bully those who cross the akhoonds "Red Lines". People like Fred! But being a soosool, he can not take a bit of his own poison! That is why he is so hurt by my comments that he can not stop crying!

I know you are a smart guy, and I am sure you already know the facts I mentioned above.

Dear Hamal,

It's all about intolerance of other opinions. As I mentioned above, Majid Naficy posts about as many blogs as Fred does. He posts the English version on this side and the Persian version of the same poem(s) on the Persian side. Have you ever heard of anyone complaining about him posting too many blogs for any reason? I haven't. Fred on the other hand...every day there's a new excuse why he should be banned, why he should stop posting, etc....

This is the problem with Fred's blogs: it's written solely and entirely in the interest of (filthy, anti-Semitic, child killer Zionists in) Israel. Period.

Thanks for making my point nitwit.

Mini-malijak. I just deleted your comment because you used profanity. Be polite and you won't get deleted. Now, I know why you're doing this. You're trying to show that I'm intolerant. That's not the case. I will, however, not tolarte profanity. 

PS- I only blocked you for a few hours on my last blog so that you could calm down. I then unblocked you. Now, if you continue with profanity, you will be blocked again. 

PSS- I love it when I get under your skin so much that you start using profanity. I think that I'm the best at getting you all riled up on this site. It's priceless.

hahaha...mr. tolerant...shame of preaching without practice...

I am extremely intolerant of profanity. Don't use it and you won't get deleted or blocked. Use it, and you will. I never used profanity against SAM. Now, I do have to tell you that you are probably the most detestable character I have ever come across--and that includes viruses and bacteria. You have no morals or standards, and your entire existence on this site (or perhaps in real life) is to be the equivelant of herpes. One would have thought that evolution would have gotten rid of elements like you...but unfortnately no process is perfect. :-(

Guess who's riled up... :)

Still owe me an answer: Was Shah a terrorist?

I'm sorry mini. I can't give you any of my precious time at the moment. My dog is peeing right now, and that's a more important event to attend to than to carry on a conversation with you. And after that she will be pooping, which is even a more important thing to watch than anything you post. So, sorry for now. Hopefully some day in the future I'll circle back to you. :-)

Be as funny as you want...but still...you brought up the subject and you have to finish it...Was shah a terrorist?...

Dear AO,

I am surprised that Shazde has blocked you. In fact I just posted a comment addressed to you in his blog.

With respect to deleting comments and blocking users, I used to be against it but I am completely in support of it now and wish every user would exercise some type of control in his/her blogs. Just look at the diatribe between you and Ibn-Oghde in here. A completely useless exchange that no one find interesting. Wouldn't it be better if you deleted his comment and blocked him to stop such an important discussion to be diverted into such nonsense? I think the freedom of speech is like a garden, you have to weed it out for the flowers to blossom.

With regards to certain subject such as Israel please note that the intolerance presents itself on both sides. For example many people here equate any criticism of Netanyahu or Israeli right with anti-Jewish or anti-Israeli tendencies. I think they must learn that Israel is like any other country and people have the right to criticise one group or support another in its power structure.

Now, I hope you don't mind but I have two little criticism for you too. I only bring them up because you have started a very honest discussion and I commend you for that.

1- Don't you think that in your response to Hamal you should have shown some displeasure about the language that he had used about SAM?

2- Shazde has been posting here for many years and his views are known to all. We also know he sometimes snaps. I have seen blogs from Shazde in complete support of Israel. They are his snap views too. In general like any other contributor he should be judged based on his entire contribution. Don't you think you should have been fairer to him and mentioned those facts instead of just portray him as a completely intolerant person based on one interaction?

Dear AO,

I just had an eye-opening exchange with Shazde. He told me be careful when you block people because the feature does not work right and it blocks other poeple too without your knowledge. I let him know that it had already happened to me and when I tried to block  Ibn-oghde it blocked Hamal and Red Wine too of which I had no knowledge. Do you think that may be what has happened here? Specially as it is so out of Shazde's character to block you for that comment.

Dear Divaneh - thanks for your comment. To respond to your comments, I will say the following: first, in terms of free speech, I do disagree with you a bit. I think that if you write a blog, you should take the heat. I do agree to some limit though, and that being trolling and profanity. I think comments that cross the line into offensiveness and trolling should be deleted, and if the user continues it, she should be blocked from that thread. And I have done so before. There are also those who satlk bloggers and deliberately sabotage a blog. That's their job. They're either on someone's payroll, they are bikar, or they are mentally ill. I think this multi-username herpes virus that you refer toomay be all three. 

In terms of the Palestine / israel thing, I couldn't care less. Not our problem. The two sides can nuke each other as far as I'm concerned. That whole discussion shouldn't be a part of discourse on Iran issues. It's a distraction and a red herring that is usually thrown in by the IR and its agent to distract from the real discussion. And if there are Iranians who are truly obsessed with that issue, they should move to Israel or Palestine and defend their respective sides there. Not on Iran's time.

As far as your criticism (which I welcome BTW), here are the answers: 1) No, my comments shouldn't have. As I said in my comment on SAM's blog, I usually don't get involved in other people's fights. For the same reason, I didn't say anything to SAM in my comment to him when he used vile profanity against Hamal. I believe he called Hamal:

"motherfuckerpieceofshitassholesonofawhore"

I believe that's far worse than anything that Hamal has ever called him. So, if I wanted to express outrage it should have been in response to this vulgarity. I thnk both of these guys are adults, and they should take care of their own battles.

2) Again, I don't care about SAM's views on Israel or Palestine. He can be pro Israel or pro Palestine. That's not my issue. And I really don't know why you keep dragging Isreal and Palstine into the discussion. I don't think his blog was on that subject. Neither were my comment or his. So, again, I'm at a loss as to why you keep mentioning it.

I disagree that SAM has been totally tolerant. he posted an attack blog about Fred (which he later deleted). he demaned that Fred leave the site, and when that didn't happen, he left the site. To me, that's extremely intolerant. I have never demaned anyone leave any site or stop posting, even if they are the most pro-IR bloggers. To block me for a polite criticism shows extreme intolerance, and he needs to be called to account for it. He is of course, fre to post whatever he wants here on this thread and explain why he blocked me.

Lastly, if blocking me was a "mistake," then again, he is free to come here and say so. If that's the case, I will take whatever I have said on this blog back and will delete it. But so far, he has not said anything. So, I'll have to take the facts as they stand. 

A new blog entry comes at the end of the list on the front page. The top picks are by JJ or sub. The chosen blogs have * against them (in today's example the first 9). So they do get top billing, some regularly for the controversial value (my guess) and click generation rather than original content.  JJ stopped putting Vijeh after a couple of Felestine supporters threw their toys out of the pram.  Trolls and Flamers are a feature of Internet.

Sorry to digress, did anyone notice how Bazari Saeeed dropped the most debated items list from The Iranian quite a while ago? JJ dispensed with that from day 1. It is possible to see the sites most visited, the most Bilakhed but not the hop topics. I guess it's all about clicks and debate is a secondary consideration nowadays.

Dear COP- I checked my blocked list. You're not blocked. I would never block you. Please try posting a test comment.

To be clear the top nine at the time of writing were editor's top picks and are the not the latest blogs. The latest two blogs (again at the time of writing) were two of Fred's "Me/Video" on page 2, and "Iran/Traitors" on bottom of page 1. Once the editor wakes up then we shall see which one makes the "Front Page". We asked for some differentiation of the blogs so cannot complain about the method, whether his choice is any good that is a different debate.

Dear Fozolie - I don't want to see this site being completely dominated by Fred's blogs either. But in the absence of other material, this is what JJ has to deal with. The onus is on other contributors to post more material. It will create diversity. The solution, however, is not to ban Fred. But we all know that most people who raise objections about Fred have other motives. A lot of them (and I'm NOT referring to Faramarz) made the same "ya man ya Fred" threats on the old iranian.com also when we had more content.

I have no issue at all with Fred. The problem JJ has is attracting original material. Agreed (hence the reference to throwing toys...).  And we seem to have such thin skins.  

AO jaan, as much I want to NOT repsond to Comrad, I had posted a response to him since he wouldn't STFU, and was rejected as "blocked".  But no worries, however, I must agree with you that:

The Pals and Israeli issue is none of our F'ing business - so all chest beaters of the Pal issue should get over it.

Cheers

Dear AO:

AS you just read from the comments, Fred is a thorn in the evil eye of Mullahs malijak in USA, Trita Parsi and his 24/7 multiple account holder cyber click whore on iroon.com ! That is one reason  I like Fred So much! Other reason is he writes so very well in Farsi. So he is Iranian like myself and you. And I hate seeing another Iranian being attacked by a person with a palistinian father who can not identify his country or his father! That is regardless of what Fred writres or thinks!!!

Dear COP- You better ignore that troll. Not worth your time. 

Dear Hamal - I don't read every Fred blog, and I disagree with him on many issues, but the fact that he has been such a thorn in the side of the ommat-e Islam just tells me that he's foing something right. The fact that by posting a blog he gets under their skin to the extent that they leave the site says more about them than it does about Fred. I hate to say this, but after 37 years of the IR, Iranians haven't really changed much. 

Thanks for the timely blog AO! If I remeber correctly, right after the Fred/SAM episode you described, SAM tried to get back at Fred by publishing some blog about Jews commiting a holocaust against Iranians on the Jewish holiday of Purim. Talk about following the Mullah narrative!! 

HI AI- Thanks for stopping by. Long time no see. 

Look, these people have this obnoxious mentality that Fred is fair game, and they can post and say anything they want about him, and no one should dare call them on it. That's because in their minds, they have already determined that Fred is a group of Mossad agents posting on this site, and that his blogs will end up in an attack on Iran. I know...it's silly to the point of being mental. But bear with me. So, the next step in this twisted logic is that they are defending their homeland by harassing him and attempting to stop him from posting blogs. If they could just do that, Iran will be a democratic paradise in no time. It may sound strange that anyone may think this way, but what you're dealing with here is a backward Third World conspiracy theory and paranoid mentality, and also the Third World mentality of oppression of free thought and opposing points of view...which goes back to my original point that 37 years after what could only be described as a catasrophe in modern Iranian history, Iranians haven't really changed that much. 

I bet Hamsade Ghadimi is the next one to pop out of the many years of hibernation! :-)

Dear AO,

I think with respect to the free speech we are both saying the same thing but probably draw the lines in different places. Please don’t take me wrong. My skin is as thick as it needs to be and I welcome opposing views because that is the best way to fight delusion on either side. I however believe that disciplines need to be enforced in order to have free speech and constructive discussions, and that involves deleting comments or blocking people.

I brought up the issue of Israel because there is a lot of sensitivity around it on both sides and it is very much related to the subject of this blog and Iranian's intolerance. In fact over a year ago I wrote a blog about the very same subject of intolerance using the Israel-Palestine issue as an example.

The reason that I brought up the Israel in relation to Shazde was because you said they have called Fred Israeli. I wanted to show that it meant nothing in SAM's case as he had nothing against Israel. I also think we should talk about other countries and subjects in here without restricting ourselves to purely Iran's issues.

I am not here to defend Shazde, nor know any more than you do about his motives. As he has not responded I just give you my take on it. I don't think Shazde left because of his objection to Fred. He wrote beside Fred for many years. I think the main reason was the low number of views in this site. In fact he told you in the other blog the reasons for his departure and I don’t think Fred was part of that. I can't understand why you think that was the cause of his departure.

With blocking, it is not about making mistake; it is about the site being buggy and does something without your knowledge. This happened to me as I explained. Hamal bad mouthed me in another site for that. Red Wine did not jump into a conclusion, sent me an email and asked me politely in another thread that why I had blocked him. I apologized and explained that it was not me but the site that had done it. I think that has been the case here too.

Thanks A.O. for your analyse of Fred haters. It was very interesting.

I never block anyone. I don't post very often and what I post is mostly music and some links. But the idea of blocking others has never occured to me. For those reasons that a person should be blocked, I believe there should be an editorial decision to be made and not by the users. That feature shouldn't be available to the users at all.

Ignoring some users on the other hand, is a great feature that I use frequently because it is a personal choice which doesn't impose anything on anybody. I sometimes even ignore J.J. for few days to see what else is posted here other than cats and dogs! But blocking by the users just doesn't make any sense. It should be an editorial decision. I have a very classic mindset about journalism and media outlets in this regard.

AO Jan:

Good to read your blogs again.

I've been visiting this site less and less recently, primarily  because of family & work and not due to any lack of interest. But dont you think that iroon is begining to look more and more like the old site? Looking through one of your own links I also noted that the old site iranian.com is down for some reason. Could that explain this hostile situation? All the trolling, name calling , lumpenism by the usual crowd with recycled user accounts and IDs?

"I've been visiting this site less and less recently,"

Comrade,

I blocked you. I warned you not to use profanity and not to troll on my posts. I gave you a chance. But you simply cannot control yourself. I will let your profanity laced comment stay for now so that people know why you were blocked. I may unblock you at some point if I see it appropriate. But for now, you're getting a time out for using profanity and for trolling. I told you, I have zero tolerance for profanity and for trolling. 

PS-It is quite extraordinary how many people are intolerant of Minimal for simply writing comments. Even my friend AO seems to be upset about it (see AO’s comment). My goodness. The fucking guy is posting COMMENTS. How far will you guys go to silence him? You don’t like his comments, DON’T READ THEM! How intolerant can you people be? 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Now, the last comment before me, yes the angry potty mouth one,  is what I call a classical "self defense move"!!!!

:)))))

Big difference, and not even close. Fred posts blogs. This character trolls other people's blogs and harasses them using profanity. If Fred does the same thing, he should be blocked too. Plus, I have never asked for this troll to be banned from postinng material, even though he does so openly under many usernames. Just look at the video part of the site and see how he polluts it on a daily basis. He has posted four videos within the past 24 hours. Have you ever complained that he posts too many videos and sucks up the oxygen from all other users who want to post videos?

Dear AO,

In my comment to Shazde’s NoRooz greeting, I made a reference to the people who use vulgar language and profanity and, those who flood the site with garbage blogs and material 24x7. I did NOT name any person or user id and left it to the reader to make that determination. You took it upon yourself to write a blog, make some assumptions and drag me into it. You even associated my good name with “intolerance” and other things.

I wrote 2 comments on your blog and further explained what I had in mind. But you, instead of apologizing and correcting yourself tried to drag Mr. Nafisi who has nothing to do with this and posts occasional poems on the site (please go back and look at the last 30 days of blogs in English and Farsi.)

I posted this comment today just to point out the hypocrisy of your blog and let you know that you crossed the line in your blog. I still consider you a person that has a lot in common with me and my views, but needs to be corrected here and there, as a friend of course!

Faramarz- Thank you for expressing your point of view, and for your crticism. I do have to say though that you made it clear on this thread that you were talking about Fred. Read your comments. 

Niloofar Parsi Joonam!

Feeling under immense pressure? When are you going to bring in your amikabear4u and PJ also my habibi bi bi?

:))))

Just so that everyone knows, SAM appeared on this blog and posted a comment full of profanity. For that reason, his comment was deletd. He did claim that he has not blocked me. He is welcome to to post a polite comment. If he keeps posting profanity, he will be blocked.

It's funny dear Hamal how people become unhinged. Now he has posted his comment as a blog. :-)

Dear Divaneh - Thanks for your comment. I have to say though that just because someone blogged next to Fred, it does not mean that they didn't hate him, or constantly asked for him to be banned. Iraj Khan (a/k/a Mollah Nasreddin), one of regular IR agents on iranian.com was one of the original creators of the whole story about Fred being a collection of Israeli agents, etc., which has been repeated by SAM, comrade, etc. And he blogged next to Fred for many years. So did Souri, who has also demanded that Fred be banned, and has accused him (and me for that matter) of being a part of an Israeli conspiracy. So, just because these characters blogged on the same site and at the same time, doesn't mean that they tolerated Fred. It just means that they had no choice. And most of them--with the exception of Comrade who says that his IP has been blocked from iranian.co and Souri--stopped writing here. SAM just posted something because iranian.com is down. He now claims that I was not blocked from his blog. Unfortunately, I cannot discuss the issue with him as it was in a profanity laced comment which I had to delete, and which he has now made into a blog. 

In terms of the number of views, the problem is that this site shows "unique views" as opposed to iranian.com which shows the number of clicks, and this gives bloggers the illusion that exponentially more viewers are reading their material on iranian.com as opposed to this site. While that site has no doubt more viewers than this site, I bet you that if the view count on iroon.com was the same this blog for instance will have at least hundreds of views as opposed to what we see now. I had suggested to JJ to correct this when he re-designed the site, but unfortunately it remained the same. 

And you are correct reagrding the blocking issues. I had a real hard time blocking Comrade. It took me a while. 

Cheers.

Dear Benross- Thanks for the observation. I agree with you on the editorial control. In fact, whenever the subject of comment control was discussed, I voiced my objection to it (mainly on the old site). But this site unfortunately has no editorial comment control. You can't even flag a comment. In the absence of that some degree of control is needed so that the thread does not become a place where discussions are derailed by trolls and profanity becomes the order. And that's where blocking persistent offenders comes in.

Dera Roozbeh. Thanks for dropping by. You're right. Unfortunately, JJ does not provide much editotial control over the debates here, and like I said above, it is up to the bloggers to weed out the bomb throwers. I am against blocking and bloggers even having control over the comments if there was a system in place where comments / posts could be mointored by moderators, like the old IC. It wasn't perfect, but it somehow worked.

Yet again, with people like us who can't unite to save our own lives, is it any wonder that our ancestral land is now ruled by a bunch of unedcuated, opportunitistic, anti nationalist,  power hungry, murderous, thieving bunch of thugs?

we can't get it together people, so we get what we deserve!

You are absolutely correct dear COP. I do believe that we can have honest disagreements with one another without resorting to vulagrity, threats, and silencing other points of view. That's how every civilized society has ever moved forward. Unfortunately, that is yet to be the case in our culture. At this moment though we should all be reminded of Faramarz's wise words when he said:

"For example, going around and leaving vulgar comments and messages is not free speech. It is a lack of class and questionable upbringing."

Very true!

BTW, SAM's recent blog is very distasteful and very much inline with his ranting about Fred. The guy appears to fly off the handle so easily. Again, any wonder why we are so f'ed up as a nation??

Maa irooni haa hich-vaght adam nemisheem......

Can somebody please answer my question here? How long is this Jaang'e Zaargarry edaameh khahad dasht? Thank you! :-)

What a freaking jerk.

I posted a little comment on this Ass.,,dollah's pathetic short blog, and said : take it easy bro...calm down

and he replied: EASY WAS UR MOMY AND WE ALL ENJOYED HER

I could not copy and paste it but it is all there for ya'll to see.

What a Moddaafing POS!!!

Ex-cop.

What are you talking about "we Iranians can not unite"?

This creature,  is clearly a NIACi cyber troll  on IRI payroll (through Trita Joon of course), using many accounts and names such as "shazdeh Ass Dola", "Minimalist, and so  on internet to push IRI agenda.

I rather eat salad for the rest of my life than "unite" with an IRI low life with dubious parentage!!

Dear AO,

I don't know what some people's fuss over Fred's blogs is about. I get to read some news about Iran and enjoy an article to go with it reminding me of the daily atrocities commited by the Akhoondi regime and its supporters. That his blogs serve that purpose is good enough, in my opinion, to support his objectives given the plethora of pro-regime ''news'' that is propagated in Iran and elsewhere among western 'liberals'.

As far as the offensive comments are concerned, I understand what your position is and I respect it. But there will always be a group of irrational, foaming at the mouth, Shah and 'Emrika' haters who will never hesitate to disrespect anyone who wasn't raised on Hezbollahi propaganda.

The arrogance and disrespect these people display toward the Iranian diaspora and any other secular/nationalist group that doesn't toe the IRI line is characteristic of the behavior of simple minded individuals both comfortable of their backing by a despotic regime, as well as the threat that that same regime could retaliate against them upon their return on 'vacation' to Iran should they cross any red lines themselves.

Which is why I like to check these camels every chance I get. I think you can appreciate that. lol 

Dear AO,

I am sorry but I think you are making a false analogy. How another user felt or what he/she did cannot simply be extendedto SAM or anyone else. I don't think any of us can say who hates who but it is easy to spot the disagreements. Regardless of whether he liked or disliked Fred or just tolerated him, he kept contributing to the site for all these years alongside him and never found it a reason to leave the site. As he explained to you, he left because of the low number of visitors and the hostile crowd. I cannot see why you insist to enforce your own analysis about the reasons for his departure.

I am aware of the way that the site measures the views. In fact I devoted my first English blog here to the subject. I likewise have advised against such statistics that puts the site well below the competition in the eyes of the unaware visitors. Lets hope he changes that.

Sorry everyone for not responding to comments earlier. As it is every spring, I was in the woods with the boys of Conservation Services tagging some black bears since Friday, and I barely get any cell signal there, let alone 4G or wi fi. So, I haven't been able to visit the site for a few days.

In any event, to respond: Dear Doctor41. Thanks for your blog, and for bringing into attenstion the profanity laced post which JJ refused to take down. It's his site, and he can do whatever he wants with it, but it was my site, I wouldn't ahve allowed blogs containing profanity --with a title containing profanity--to be posted on my site. With regard to the response he left you which you mention in your comment, it's really unfortunate. But we need to be reminded once again of Faramarz's wise words when he said:

 "For example, going around and leaving vulgar comments and messages is not free speech. It is a lack of class and questionable upbringing."

So, as Faramarz correctly points out, you either have the class and the proper upbringing or you don't. And if you don't, you call people names, attack people with profanity, and do other things that people with no class or proper upbringing do. And I'll just leave it at that.

Dear COP-Thanks for the comment. I agree. It shows how a person can be so unhinged. It quite remarkeable to see it. I'm not a psychologist, but I would suggest therapy to deal with anger issues.

Dear Hamal - I'm sorry, and you know I love you, but I had to stick to my policy and delete commenst that contain profanity, and for that reason, I deleted one of your comments that contained one against SAM. Sorry my friend.

Dear AravandRud - Thanks for stopping by! I can only describe the hatred against Fred in the same line that you have. Look, you and I have been on this site, and the old iranian.com for years now, and we have seen threats, accusations, and stalking against Fred gon on since he appeared on these sites. Fred's stalkers included (but were / are no limited to) Abarmard, Bavafa, P-J, Iraj Khan, a/k/a Mola Nssreddin, Souri, Shazdeh Assdollah Mirza, Comrade (and his many other usernames), Niloufar Parsi (and HIS many other usenames), and many others. The list is endless. I guess the reason is that these people are used to getting their way with people. For 27 years they have silenced all opposing points of view by way of threats, intimidation, accusations, etc., and when they can't get their way they go nuclear. I personally don't read most of Fred's blogs. Just like evryone else's blogs, I click on the ones with an interesting subject line. I also disagree with him on many issues. But I think that he (and everyone else for that matter) should post whatever they want so long as it's not harassing, does not contain profanity, and is not trolling. 

I also think this is a function of iranian.com being down. Some of these guys are really hurting...not being able to rant about the U.S., Jews, Suadis, etc... So, you see this kind of aggressive behavior.

Hamal,

If you beleive by insulting others and wishing thermo-nuclear destruction (I know it wasn't you, but didn't see you object either) on our motherland, we can unite, then I have nothing to say to you.

And eating salad is good for you as you need to give ur body a break from eating too much "dead animal flesh". i.e., meat!

Dear Divaneh. I'm really having a hard time wrapping my head around the whole "hostile crowd" thing. I can't think of any other person aside from Hamal that SAM had an issue with. Can you name someone else? Are you telling me that a blogger cannot stand ONE single person who is hostile to him (whom he can block from his posts), and in response, he has to write a blog accusing Fred of all kinds of things and then leave the site? Is the blogger that soosool? If he is, then he shouldn't be blogging. Had you ever seen my blogs on iranian.com? Had you seen the dozens of hostile comments, threats, and attacks that I got on every single one of my blogs everytime I wrote one? Hell, I even posted a news article there once and got more than 80 comments, most of them hostile--to the point that JJ had to stop people from commenting on the thread. I posted a three sentence blog once asking people to say what the IR has done that was positive for Iran since it came to power and got more than 300 comments, a great number hostile, and JJ had to stop the comments. I wrote a blog about poetry and got attacked endlessly. And all of these attacks were by dozens of various usernames. Should I have "ghahr'ed" then and left?!!! No! I was blogging, and I took the heat. That's what adults do. We don't throw temper tantrums--especially when we put ourselves out in the open for it. So, respectfully, I don't buy that whole "hostile crowd" thing. It just doesn't persuade me. I guess we just have to agree to disagree on that.

And BTW, what about SAM himslef? Isn't he a pasrt of this "hostile crowd" that harasses other bloggers? What about his unprovoked attacks on Fred, like the blog that he has now deleted? Or this portion of another blog of his which has not yet been deleted?

 4. Farsi Radio Esrael Division (FRED) will continute dominating Iroon.com, keeping most viewers out and upset.

Isn't this a hostle and unprovoked attack on another blogger?

Why did he post it? Do you approve of it? Isn't he a part of the same culture that he complains about? Isn't he being a hypocrite?

Thanks again for your comments. I value your input.

Dear AO,

You and I have rather extensive experience on Felestine.com dealing with the anti-Shah/anti-western attack dogs of the IRI and their communist former allies. We have engaged in discussions and debates with these types and know exactly what their talking points are and how to respond to them accordingly. We even gathered a sort of 'team' on the other site assisting each other and running a sort of defensive campaign in the face of attacks from the other side that attracted hundreds, often thousands of views and a regular following by Iranians who were ready for a fresh 'not left or right wing' viewpoint that put Iran's interests first without injecting the Palestinian issue or any other distractions that are the weapons of choice for the other side.

We NEVER attacked other secular nationalists and monarchists even when they would ramble incoherently about subjects that might harm our cause. 

But I have noticed a different phenomenon here on this site that actually made me pause and rethink the situation. We both know how we approach the subject of Iran and its relationship with the outside world. We look at what is in Iran's actual national interest regardless of whether our views are seen as 'liberal' or 'conservative', 'pro-Israel' or 'anti-Israel', 'pro-western or anti-west'. I think most of the monarchists and other secular nationalist groups there thought along these lines as well.

What I have noticed here is truly original in my opinion. I'm refering to individuals who identify as 'monarchists' but would also like to demolish their former homeland to punish 'mooslems' or some such nonsense. These people (not all of them or even the majority) display a lack of empathy with not just the IRI, which we all agree is rotten to the core, but with Iranian history, culture, language and anything else that secular nationalists like us treasure and have been arguing in favor of for our entire lives.

What sort of 'monarchist' will attack and try to isolate other Shah supporters just because they couldn't care less about Israel and the their fight with the arabs? Let me just make it clear once again that I would like Iran and Israel to be friends again like we were during Shah's time, but I personally don't give a d@%# what the arabs and Israelis do to each other. It is non of our business and only serves as a distraction to the real problems in Iran.

Dear ArvandRud-Thank you for your comment. I totally agree with pretty much everything you said, especially when you say:

We look at what is in Iran's actual national interest regardless of whether our views are seen as 'liberal' or 'conservative', 'pro-Israel' or 'anti-Israel', 'pro-western or anti-west'. I think most of the monarchists and other secular nationalist groups there thought along these lines as well.

Absolutely correct! To me, every nation on this planet is--and should be really--out for its own interests. That includes the U.S. The United States has no love of democracy or other ideal when it come to Iran--or any other country for that matter. They're out for their own interests. So, we shouldn't be fooled for a moment that there is any country on this planet that will be willing to put its money and the lives of its soldiers on the line for democracy or freedom in Iran. Nor should they. They don't owe Iran anything. Furthermore, I have always been against a military attack on Iran. An attack will not get anywhere. Period. The IR has set up a system that pretty much assures Iran's disintegration in the event of a military attack on Iran. That's the bitter reality. Now, what's the solution? I really don't know. Reform? Very small possibility. In my opinion, it will not happen--at least not in the next 3-4 generations. It's a pie in the sky thing. Any other solutions? I don't have an answer. But I know that military attack is not one of them. But I tell you though that the IR has pissed off enough nations in the world and its neighborhood that I won't be surprised if they gang up on Iran and do what they did to Syria. I hope it doesn't happen for the sake of the people, but I won't be surprised if it did.

Dear AO, If Iran does get attacked, it will be no one's fault but the regime and it's 37 years of 'death to America' sloganeering and meddling in the affairs of other nations. But what I'm talking about here is not simply some concerned Iranians who wish to bring democracy to Iran. What I'm seeing is actually rather disturbing. I've only heard this sort of language from some of the most backward and racist segments of American society. You know what I'm talking about. You've come across those people who are so ignorant that they can't even find Iran on the map and their answer to any problems in the middle east is 'why don't we just nuke them gawd dang ayrabs'? This is not simply wanting to free our people from the evil akhoond regime. This kind of talk doesn't come from any monarchists or secular nationalists I know. No. This is something else.

I know. I've noticed some of that too. I really don't have an answer. Don't know what to say....

For 37 years Iran was invaded by an Islamic regime and for 37 years the opposition failed to neutralize Islam. It's as simple as that.

Did we really have an oppostion to this regime? or we were just a bunch of irrelevant victims?

Having said that, the 'heated debates' of the past had to come to an end, not through 'reconciliation' but through a total exhaustion and general bancrupcy. And this is a good thing.

Agreed dear Benross. I do have to say though that the IR has been EXTREMELY successful at eradicating, infiltrating, and neutralizing the opposition during that period of time. They have used infiltration, accusation, propaganda, deflection of blame, and every other textbook tactic used by dictatorial regimes to achieve that end. They have elimintaed all real and effective opposition. Look at this and other Iranian sites for example. You can't write a sentence without their online army shows up and accuses you of being a Jew, or a part of some other foreign service. It's amazing how they operate too. It's always the same narrative, the same accusations, the same talking points. You know the orders come from the top. 

It will take generations--if ever--for Iranians to organize enough to remove this regime. I think the IR is here to stay for a very long time.

And if I may, this has a lot to do with the Iranian mentality (which is the subject of this blog) of being conspiracy minded, over the top emotional, irrational, and distrustful of everyone. Look at it this way: if you believe that a blogger like Fred is a collection of Mossad agents posting under one account on an obscure site that no one probably has heard of, with the intention of causing a military attack on Iran, then you're really bound to believe anything.

I don't believe this regime is here to stay at all. This exhaustion and total banckrupcy was a prerequisite from which a real oppostion will be born... and in short notice!

But you are right that the regime collaborators were using textbook diversion tactics and were very successful. But when Rafsanjani called his son back home, that was a sign that these collaborators are loosing their effectiveness.

There was a time that Trita Parsi was viewed as a respected 'moderate' social activist by many. Look at him now!

The case with Trita is a classic example of him outliving his usefulness. He was useful during the sanctions (just like Siamak Namazi & Babak Zanjani). Now that sanctions are lifted and the regime has financial breathing room, he is no longer of any use. Hence, the efforts to make him a non-entity. He's lucky that he's not in Iran. Otherwise, he'll be in the same place as Zanjani and Namazi.

My point is what's the point of sanctions, or any other means of pressure, when there is no real opposition to take advantage of? This issue also was a diversion which is no longer there to inflame irrelevant debates. There is always grounds for increased pressure on IRA by the international community. But as long as there is no structured oppostion in place to take advantage of, it will only be another diversion!

Completely agree. There's no organized or effective opposition--inside or outside of Iran--to build on the pressure. And that's really what Iran needs: a domestic, effective opposition. I say it won;t happen anytime soon. You say that it probably will. I hope you're right! 

I'm always right dear AO!

I know benross. :-)

I do have to say benross, along the lines of what you say, I have great hope for the youth of Iran. Really, the Iranian youth are well traveled and well educated, and are not bound by the dogma, the hatred for the West, blind hatred of the Pahlavi family, the anti-Semitism, the anti-Arabism, and the old, obsolete idologies that bog down the rifraf that you see on most Iranian sites. These guys are like a person drowning, and is trying to hold on to a lifeline. Their revolution failed, their battle with the West failed, their USSR collapsed...so now they're angry, and are fuming with rage and hate. Their entire existence has been a failure now--as most of them are in their 50's and 60's. So, what do they do? The pollute the cyberspace--and often TV stations--with nonsense, and try to pick fights with those who disagree with them in the slightest. They label them, create fantasies about them, and then they pick fights with those imaginary characters that they have created out of others who dare challenge them on their failed ideology. And they will take that baggae to their graves with them. The former Toudehis, the former "revolutionaries,"...Che Guevara wannabes...bunch of losers. The youth in Iran does not have that baggage.  

What a nice exchange you guys have got going on here and i enjoyed it tremendously.

I think what some of you , particularly you AO jan is overlooking is the type of reaction those of us who live in iran are witnessing. What happens on a daily basis in iran and on the ground is so different with what you see in the papers or think may be happening . FOr instance, you may be surprised that no matter how dissatisfied or discontent people are in iran, they will always find a way to cope, NOT THAT i like that strategy and as a matter of fact i think it is sad. But there is this altered mentality, that everything this regime puts down, people just pick it right up and they do it with enthusiasm. That to me, i don't care how far down the road you look, won't even come close to implementing the idea of an organized movement to topple anything. People have accepted this.

The thing about the youth is that , unfortunately, even they have succumbed to this system and are trying to work with it, not so that they could change it fundamentally, but to become a part of it. It is a totalitatrian system, and you have got only two options, You become a part of it or it will get rid of you. How can that be an incentive for reform and change? Because even if there is chnage, it will end up benefiting the regime, at the end. Is that a proper context for change from withing? I highly doubt it.

So, No. Despite what some people here say or imply, the solution is not to carpet bomb and level things down to the ground, but the solution IS to seek help from the outside. True, No country cares enough to lend a hand, but then again, if that does not happen , the people will continue living the same life, watching helplessly as their lives are passing them by, having to comply with the "tweaked" but not reformed policies that this regime sets for them.

IS that a workable , viable option there?

Dear Doctor41 - Thanks. I hope that this exchange has been beneficial to our community. We certainly can use more discussion and engagements within our community.

The Iranian youth are doing the best they can, and they are nothing like the fossil ex-revolutionary, ex-Toudeie rifraf that you see polluting the airways and cuberspace with their leftover complexes and their "oghdeh" about losing everything that they had hoped they would accomplish. I certainly wouldn't advocate for them to pour onto the streets and get hemselves killed to remove the IR while I sit behind my computer in the U.S. Like I said before, war is deinitely not an option. I personally don't think that reform will work in the next 3-4 generations in Iran also. So, what's the solution? I don't know. I really don't. Can help from outside work? Only if it's done without an eye to military attack, and only if it facilitates something that is already happening in Iran. In other words, no half baked plans by someone sitting in an office in DC. If people inside of Iran start something, and a small nudge helps them from the outside, then that's fine. Also, it should not involve any kind of military option. 

PS- you have blocked me from your blog. :-)

Dear AO,

I agree that we have to agree to disagree. In reposnse to your questions I have to say that I don't approve of anyone usign profanity or bullying tactics in the comments. Insults can never take the place of a constructive discssion. The best answer to insults is to ginore the comment and delete it if you can.

AO jan'

Dude. I am so sorry, i left a little note at the end saying i had no idea what the hell happened i was reading comments and pushing buttons and there it was! it was not intentionaal man.

Regarding your suggestion, it does sound reasonable but is it practical? No millitary option? No inside coups? Like i told you , people are not ready to embrace any changes , despite bitching and moaning about all kinds of shit all day-one big reason i avoid people and public, cuz i am tired of all their complaining assez and then see that they won't do a damn thing about it..- So don't waste time hoping that anyone is gonna do anything from the inside. Even if they do, They will get caught , put in jail, or use their contacts to leave and go abroad!!!

Benross

This was not a mere observation man, it was the situation on the ground as the majority of iranians see it and live it. All the points that you have brought up here is good and legitimate, but I don't understand your argument here. So, you are saying that after the dust settle and once we have everything in order , we will devise /restore our legitimate constitution of a modern iran, which is the same as monarchial constitution...yet at the same time it may result in ending the monarchial system??!!!

could you shed some light on that one?

We don't have modern political parties. It doesn't matter if we have a monarchy system or a republican system. We don't have modern political parties to function within. The system is not the issue. Modernity is. Mehrabn posted a blog recently on this subject.

When there is no modern political parties to negociate and unite for whatever common goal (and it did not and could not happen in the past 37 years) the only common values we can unite around is whatever modernity we achieved collectively as a society and historically. And this achievement is historically registered as constitutinal monarchy. And historically, this achievement was what Khomeini devolution intended to destroy. We go from there.

I posted my political program draft in Iranian dot com which is no longer available. In Khodnevis as well. I'll post it here in Iroon Persian again when I found enough time. But yes, you got the general idea! We discuss it later.

Benross

What you claim makes total sense when there is near-absolute unity amongst the people in a nation. It requires a fundamental sense of balance and togetherness, people need to feel this in their bones and souls. Look at what is taking place in the states; all the chaos during the primaries, all the hustle and bustle , yet uniformity as a principle is preserved. i actually happen to think the society evolves and there are lessons in it that people look into and learn. In other words, the country does not fall apart, they do not disintegrate, in the midst of all these various ideologies, rules, opinions, etc.

That is How things work in the states, Canada, germany and many other countries, because people make sure that order is always restored.

Compare that to iran and iranians, Most if not all of them. Sure, they get the first part right, they come up with all forms of beautiful and elegant slogans and solutions and ideas, but when you look into it deeper, they are in it for themselves, it is about their interests, with or without a constitution. People do not finish the job, because if thinsg don't work, they can just get the hell out and save their own bottomline and start fresh somewhere else. There is no continuity. There is no fate. There is no adhereing to the set principles.

We suffering from a "multi-sloganeering" syndrom. We do not deeply believe in what we say and do, We are just great at making promises, That is all!

LOL

My previous post got on here right before i read your last one. you beat me to it i guess.

I agree. Modernity is the issue here and i concur with you, But how can you ensure that a nation can learn everything about what modernity entails? How do you teach and educate people who by nature, are againts learning new values and only care about what gets their lives moving?

Sure. Let's have new and modern political parties and let's give them ample space to manuvere and just take over. But please do tell me what Have we achieved in the way of Modernism , or modernity? Have we learned how to effectively and efficiently voice our opinions? Have we bothered to put the principles of democray into use, the way it was brought to us throughout our history?

What has been our proudest , aw-inspiring achievement in the most recent decades? It is like we wait for someone to bring good and constructive concepts and ideas to our lives, and then we will gladly provide a platform for the other guy to just take a jackhammer and trash it all for us , while we wait and reminisce!!

Dear Benross- I wasn't around during Shah's time, but from evertime I have read, the last decade of Shah's rule was the most politically democratic period in Iran's history. Various political parties from various spectrums operated --for the most parts--freely. From Jebheyeh Melli to Toudeh to the MEK, to various other communist groups such as Chreek Fadaii, to Islamists--all operated from insdie Iran. None of their leaders were imprisoned. .They were pretty much free to fundraise, distribute their material, etc  Sure there was a bit of harassment here and thereBut compared to the rest of our modern history, and the neighborhood that we're in--which has zero tradition of democracy--it was pretty minor stuff. . If the people of Iran could have only given refrorm a chance then, we could have built on that. No questions about it. Instead, they were hell bent upon removing Shah at any cost!  The result if what we have today. And today, after ths brutal regime destroyed every single institution of a civil society, and has created the most feared police state in modern Iran history, the same "revolutionaries" --now in their 50's and 60's and infesting colleges and universities in the West such as Abbas Edalat, along with cyberspace and airwaves--are advocating "reform," and have moved on from "fixing" iran to trying to solve the Israel / Palstine conflict.  

Dear Doctor-- You have a point, but I really can't blame the Iranian youth. I have to be honest and say that if I lived in Iran, and I had no leader or political organization to look up to and get guidance from, I wouldn't be on the streets either risking my life. Like I said before, I really don't know what the solution is. I don't know of / or have any plans. I just wish someone smarter than me can come up with a good plan to replace the mullahs without death, destruction, war, and the disintegration of Iran.

This email notification is a good thing. But they swarm like black flies! It seems that the more you comment in a blog, the notifications multiplies accordingly! anyhow;

Modernity, in terms of free thinking, is as old as humanity. Modernity, in terms of building a society based on individuals who are allowed to think free, is a contemporary issue with ongoing complexity for even the most advance societies.

The modernity I’m talking about is not aiming at defining a complex and continuously evolving issue. It only reflects a collective resolve in establishing its political power to move to that direction. Although we, as individuals, and specially we, as a society, are fully aware of our shortcomings, but we are also resolved to move toward this direction and we only need a political structure to reflect that social resolve. We should not consider our shortcomings as an obstacle. We are more than any time before AWARE of our shortcomings. This in itself guarantees our success.

Dear AO since you mentioned that you weren’t around during Shah’s time, I must say that it wasn’t as rosy as you think. The political activists -particularly those associated with the other side of the cold war- were under substantial pressure. Whether they ‘deserved’ it or not, this is an argument that can be made in another context. But they were not ‘free’ as you put it. Freedom was for all apolitical activities.

Benross

Well. That is what i am trying to tell you my friend. The theory is a great one, sure let's by all means implement that. But how do you want to do it? What steps would you take to put that into action? How do you prepare the minds of all these people who want nothing but to fulfill their own personal ambitions, and reach their personal goals, to think in more broad terms and collectively so to speak? That is your first HUGE social challennge.  Do you Think that people in iran , given their current social and economical adversities are ready to step up and take actions to put the knowledge of those shortcomings into practice?

Pardon me for saying this, but you are thinking along overly idealistic terms. You are not considering so many outside and external factors, massive corrupting, deceit that come into play. People in iran are just not cut out for this. Plain and simple.

AO jan'

Dude. i was gonna do some Omlete tonight man. I asked those Non-jewish ladies to be our guests for dinner. they do not want soup. They asked for some hard liquor and they insisted that we have to watch some russell peters comedy while we are driking them.

I am not blaming the youth. I am just saying that the level of disinterest and lack of passion is higher than before, They take on projects knowing that it would elevate the status of their "leaders" in the world. It is a form of self-deceit in my opinion.

No one is asking them to go out on the streets and risk anything, But why would they let the system exploit their talents and their hard work? What is  up with this attitiude of well the IRI is so bad and devil, but hey iran is my country so what the hell?? 

That kind of attitude may pay off in other real democratic societies, but sure as heck not in iran. I promise you that right now.