Tsirpas has already shown he's a better man than those preceding him by stopping to dig a deeper hole for Greece by Greeks with ECB and IMF crowbars and showels. What remains to be seen is whether the Greek people have the stamina to rough it out until EU realizes 'it is about the economy stupid' and EU economy has long since become a North South bipolar disorder. I have heard from several Northern colleagues that Europe should really be a North South operation. What they seem to miss is that an all Northern alliance will only pit the Northerners against each other once they don't have the Southerners to screw.
Greece is the canary in EU's mine shaft. It is not in coma yet but absent a major transformation in power and equity distribution, it might as well just call itself Euro loan sharking; driving Greece and a significant portion of EU farther left and away from a United Europe. China and Russia meanwhile, won't mind a weaker EU and U.S. was always ambivalent. Germans are going to regret what they have done to Greeks but soon it'll become clear they have done themselves in. The key meeting on this topic is between Germany and France which is telling. Listen for EU squirming to begin with their 'emergency' session tomorrow.
A Greek Comedy!
Greece with an economy based on tourism, ouzo, Kalamata olives, and grilled sardines and calamari has no place in the industrial Europe. They should go back to their own currency and easy way of life and remain a cheap tourist destination.
The Greek referendum reminded me of the Islamic Republic’s yes/no referendum back in 1979. You ask a question like that and you know what kind of response you will get!
Do you want to be responsible and payback your debt or do you want to party tonight?
79 was hype and got 99.99%. Greek is closer to reality and only managed a puny 61%
Did you get a chance to read this blog and comments http://iroon.com/irtn/blog/6786/?
Greece was as you describe when they pulled it into Euro, when they bought its best assets and when they vacationed there to enjoy the isles, Kalamata, Zorba and all. They kept lending it money under the same conditions. The biggest question is why EU? What does it do for most EU nations outside of the elite? What does it offer Greece that a well organized Greek domestic Mafia cannot?
Much for the cradle of democracy and science and philosophy (love of wisdom) and let's not forget geometry and all those gods and goddesses and literature and.....most importantly the Marathon. ... they can't even balance their check book! Baba, it's simple, don't spend more than you earn!
And one more thing....how ironic....two ancient enemies (I.e., Greece & Persia) who have managed to survive through the ages are totally bankrupt and begging for money to survive! The former is asking Germany to be given money and the latter is asking America to be given money (I.e., lifting of sanctions)!? Admit it, this is funny!
Mehrban,
Thank you for bringing focus to core issues.
There is hardly any defending Greeks lack of discipline in managing their budgets. Yet the lareger entity within which Greece is a member with hardly any say has essentially screwed Greece in every possible way. Most forget that Greeks have been cutting budget and spending for years already and most seem stuck on finance. This is not just about finace. Greek economy in small by any measure. It is about an EU system that is fixed. It is about sovereignty and dignity; and Tsipras has shown some backbone which is pissing EU and Merkel off. Greek parties after years of fighting have lined up behind him. There is a reason.
divaneh posted this relevant article on this topic http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/feb/27/greece-spain-helped-germany-recover?CMP=fb_gu
and lest it be forgotten, German's are behaving badly; and will pay a price along with EU who is the big loser in this fight.
Many of those American financial institutions which went bankrupt were in the business of lending money to financially irresponsible and ineligible people (I.e., people who had no income and yet were able to borrow almost unlimited loans) who kept fueling the artificially orchestrated housing market....off course that gay congressman Barney Franks and senator Chris Dodds had paved the way in Congress for this theft of the century years before....that's legislating in Congress to force Banks to give any amount of loan to any Hassan and Hossein no questions asked....!? The rest is History. BTW, Greece is nation of cottage renters, nut growers, olive oil producers....you can't compare them with the Germans who have invented modern science and perfected it....!
The referendum question was:
Should Greece agree to the proposals for reforms being demanded by creditors in order to release the bailout funds? Yes or No.
The creditors had already pulled the proposal so the referendum was completely inconsequential, just a way for the government to legitimize its actions based on popular vote.
I can't help it, but it still reminds me of the '79 vote!
ICW, by the measures you use a large portion of the world should be put away.
Faramarz, your assessment of mechanics of vote is correct. The bottom line was to continue with an austerity that has proven ineffective and painful; or not. Greeks are in great depression. 4 out of 5 Greeks said they want to stay in EU. yet more than 3 out of 5 of them voted against austerity. Greeks need to reform and restructure but austerity effectively has made it impossible. meanwhile, the lenders keep making the same profit. If the point is capitalism and the game is not fixed why the investors here take no losses from repeated bad investment?
Well Shashoo, at the end, the creditors will take some losses and will help Greece.
But when I hear that the Greek Orthodox Church which is the largest land owner in Greece does not pay any real estate taxes and is exempt from all taxes, I wonder why Fritz at the BMW factory in Bavaria should subsidize the Greek Orthodox Church!
Agha shashoo (:-)) : As a woman and champion of women's cause and rights, I would never ever contemplate or advocate or let alone promote the idea of using women as monetary gains! However, as a French friend of mine was telling me, many French women during WWII offered sex to the German soldiers in return for food and other amenities! I bet some Greek women may be forced to do the same for the survival of themselves and their families. Look up this Greek woman, Viky Xipolitakis!
Faramarz,
Agree they'll kiss and make up and Ger/Fre are already giving positive signals.
Fritz and his boss on the other hand both want to vacation in Greek isles, feel they have travelled back in time to an authentic and warm mediterranean Sun, and hesitently will pay the premium to keep the party going even if they hold their noses.
Jockshe, don't know what to make with Viky
Shash jaan: You certainlly don't smoke Viky if you know what I mean!
Jock, When it comes to Greece it's all about men :) hence the title of blog if u are familiar with the related joke.
Here is a good article on why Germany is the real loser: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-07/friday-afternoon-scam-cost-hedge-fund-1-2-million-and-cfo-s-job?cmpid=yhoo
"As structured now, the euro is undervalued for Germany and overvalued for southern European economies, guaranteeing German export success, trade surpluses and prosperity. Without those weak sisters, Germany's real competitiveness would be exposed and its industrial might — with a fairly valued currency — might not prove so mighty after all."
Greece is small, inciginifcant country with no natural resources, water,agriculture and industry. having Greece in Euro zone (specialy the monetery part) is likevhaving a dumb student in a class full of smart people, it will not work.
Close the shop, reopen it again with local devalue currency and make Greece cheap vacation destination and that's the end of it.
MRX,
A bit harsh. Don't you think?
If the technological finesse and accomplishment of Germans is the standard to measure up to then most of the rest of the world will qualify for your description of Greece. Greeks have high level of education, a distinguished history and a beautiful country. They benefitted from money flowing with neoliberal policies of early EU days but with hindsight they took the bait and got screwed like several other EU nations.
If political skill and intelligence is the measure, so far Tsipras has outmaneuvered and outsmarted Merkel and the rest.
The heart of this problem is not Greece but an EU economic/policy system that's supposed to deliver a more prosperous EU but so far only select EU nations lead by Germany have profitted structurally.